CDJ 2000 firmware 4.04 pitch not same as 4.01

Yes I noticed it on my last gig but I am not sure about it. Will try this out soon!

I hear more and more people about this subject..

Anything from Pioneers site on this one? 

I tried this 2 min ago. With 2 tracks both 6min long

First of all CDJ2000 1 and 2 Mastertempo OFF

               Mixt 2 tracks for 6 min  -> No drift

Second CDJ2000 1 Mastertempo OFF CDJ2000 2 Mastertempo ON

               Mixt 2 tracks for 2,5 min  -> Drift noticeable

Third CDJ2000 1 and 2 Mastertempo ON

               Mixt 2 tracks for 1,5 min  -> Drift noticeable

I have to eddit: Track Source

I have to eddit: Track Source -> USB

??? text is cut off ?

I have to eddit: Track Source -> USB Annalysed with Recordbox 1.4.1

And how do you edit or delete something in this new form ???

@DJ Meks

Thanks for posting your results!

We probably all know MT can be problematic when it comes to mixing and staying in sync..

Just to be clear, did you use different BPMs or just the same? 

@DJ Meks

We can't edit or delete posts..

If you ask me this is a major drawback because now we get a lot of double postings..

demit no edits and deletes  xD

2 different bpm’s

track 1 -> 126bpm

track 2 -> 128bpm

When you tested this where you mixing with 6 percent pitch range or 10?

10% pitch range both tracks mixt at 129BPM accurate

So it wasn´t me :)

So basically, the problems with MT are:

1. Noticeable jump on playback when the MT button is turned on
2. Although the pitch fader is at the same physical position on the decks, the tracks do not play at a constant BPM and drift
3. The MT sound output quality is still not as good as on mk3's

Although nr 1 can be annoying but is no big deal, nrs 2 and 3 are worrisome problems, especially since the 2000's have been on the market for some time now...

Can anybody comment on the MT issue when using a DVS system like Serato or tracktor? I would imagine using the computer software's keylock feature would circumvent the CDJ's issue... Is this true using both control CDs and HID modes?

yes, if you use serato or Traktor, then it is all based on their keylock or master tempo, would have nothing to do with the 2000's

I dont use Traktor or serato with cdj and either HID mode. I play with mp3s and wavs from usb or burned cds. I wont mention at all what happens when MT its turned on. I think everybody here can hear it. But I think also when MT is off the tracks are not locked as it used to be in ver 4.01. For example I start to mix 2 tracks. MT is off and both tracks are 125 bpm. The pitch is 0%. Mix starts ok after monitoring and after 30sec maybe 40sec it starts to drift. I have to use a bit the jog wheel to get it right again. In ver 4.01 after starting the mix I didnt have to worry. It used to be locked even if I had to leave the tracks together the whole time. Do you see the difference ??? or is it my crazy idea?? 

Okay.. I tested out this issue even further yesterday..

There might be a slight difference but beatmatching tracks is absolutely not a problem for me with this firmware

I've used my CDJ2000's  from version 3 and I've always had to push / pull the jog wheel to to keep tracks in time evenif they were the same BPM dead - can't say I noticed any difference really. Have others not had to worry about keeping time - blimey !?

MT - different beast altogether it's like watching a drunk trying to walk a tightrope. 

OK, question for all you guys regarding this drifting. Are you analyzing your tracks in "Normal" or "Dynamic"? For those who might not know what this means, Normal mode analyzes the track and locks in a BPM (130.13) Dynamic mode analyzes the track and constantly monitors the BPM throughout the track. So, your track might start out at 130 BPM, than 2 minutes in be at 130.2... for whatever reason, and at the end, be back at 130. I believe that Normal analysis probably accounts for drifting in a track.... This is why I analyze Dynamically. And yes, I do see random BPM changes A LOT within tracks.

Normal mode - I did ask previously whether dynamic could work better as it gives a more standard final BPM reading but Pulse advised that being on dynamic would make things worse. For the record I adore my 2000's but I don't really see massive benefits in beatmatching over the 1000's but coming from Technics I've always assumed that this is standard. 

I also use Normal mode, and overall it seems okay.. (for Electronic Dance Music)

but the track analysis mode should not influence playback anyway! MP3's are made to be played at a constant speed - whatever the grid created by RB may look like or the bpm output from the analysis.

Maybe someone can test it with the beat grid swtiched off, players should not drift. What could be a test idea is using the fader start with the same track on both players and see if the stay in sync for 8 minutes.

@ dCzeK

Its MT not working as expected and not a variation in BPM

@Dczek That's not the point. As I have proven above with MT OFF. There is a correct match for over 6 min mix (check 3rd post)

Its MT not working as expected and not a variation in BPM

Gotcha, I mean, I always analyze my music in Dynamic mode (All EDM) and I still see a BPM change. I do this because I dont want my loops to drift. example. 2 minutes in, my 128 BPM track might be 128.2 for whatever reason. If I loop that section along side with a 128 BPM track on a different deck, its gonna drift. and yes, I've tested it.

BTW, Ive never really noticed a problem with my MT... On or off. Is there a post somewhere where I can read up on this issue??

@Paulm72

Quote: I've used my CDJ2000's  from version 3 and I've always had to push / pull the jog wheel to to keep tracks in time evenif they were the same BPM dead

Pulse said that being in dynamic mode would make things worse.... I be to differ.

In Dynamic mode, BPM is constantly monitored and does change through out the track, and sometimes drastically. Any slight BPM change will cause a track to drift. and this is why you always end up nudging the platter. Normal mode is a locked in BPM. it averages the BPM of the entire track and than slaps you with a number like 130.16 rather than saying, ok. this track is a 130 BPM track; it increases slightly during the solo but than goes back to 130 BPM. I analyze everything in Dynamic mode.

You guys get what Im trying to say??

dCzek - no not to sound rude but are you not getting it the wrong way round? If you analyse in dynamic mode you've agreed that the tempo shifts - well that would mean you would need to adjust the platter. In normal mode the BPM is locked - that's what most people use for EDM including me. What i'm saying is I do analyse in Normal mode and when I've two tracks both analysed at 126BPM exactly - I nearly always have to adjust the pitch during a mix to keep it in time. this theoretically shouldn't be the case should it. 

I think what we can conclude is neither mode works perfectly 

it's a crap soot weather 2 tracks can stay perfectly in time with each other "forever"

because of the digital "stepping" of the pitch control, there is no "continuous" pitch control.

therefore you'd have to get lucky for to tracks to be able stay locked indefinitely. under most circumstances

one pitch setting will be (slightly) too slow and the next increment up would be (slightly) too fast.

however small those increments are (read +/- 6), you'd still just be getting lucky to have any 2 tracks have the

ability to stay dead nuts perfect without a infinitely continuous pitch control.

@ dCzek, doesn't electronically produced music stay dead perfect all the way through? (well, 99.9% of songs anyway)

so how does dynamic mode really help for modern day dance music? unless your talking about a diff genre altogether.