Have a feature request or suggestion? Post your idea here!

Post

8 follower Segui
0
Avatar

Strange watching CDJ 2000 with Master Tempo!?!

Hi,

 

after the last days it totaly faild playing with MT (Ver. 4.10) I started today a new try. And something very strange happend:

 

I was starting playing with MT and it worked perfectly the first 2 hours. Perfect sound quality, no drifting, accurate quantized loops. Everything fine and perfect and I was happy!

 

After 2 hours of playing suddenly it started:

Sound became worse, mixing was in fact of drifting and sloping or hacking impossible. Loops were totaly out of timing and it was impossible to go on like this. I had done nothing other than before! I mean, what the hell?!? It worked 2 hours and then the player wanna have a break and a beer?!?

Funny thing is, it was the same USB stick, after the problems had started I tried it with the same music, all genres, different pitches, different styles of mixing and handling of the player... all the same!

I'm seroiusly confused about it! Could it be, the player looses in fact of heating by running power??? But my players stand totaly alone and free, so normaly no chance to become warm, unless it heats up into the body. Room temperature is about 20 degree Celcius.

Or is it a software buck???

 

Maybe you can give me an answer!

Thanks, Greetings,

Xador

 

PS: I still wanna know what's up with the DJM 2000. You can delete my posts as often you want! ;-)

Xador

Accedi per aggiungere un commento.

64 commenti

0
Avatar

I emailed you about the DJM and I appreciate your patience.

As for the MT, I can't say it's a heat issue -- we had 3 CDJ2000's using the new firmware running at the NAMM Show for 8 hours a day and I never found any issues like you describe.  Can you try again to repeat it?

Pulse 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Sorry Puls, I havn't got any email from you till now! Maybe send it again please.

To the CDJ 2000 MT:

I'll test it again. Maybe this evening, I've got a gig, then I can test it in live conditions on a real big PA system with forein CDJ 2000s.

But anticipatory, I talked yesterday evening to 6 other DJ's who have CDJ 2000s and all has the same issues like me. I fact of this I think it is maybe an general problem. That's why I posted.

 

Greez

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

This one sure is a strange one, for a function to go mental after a set time?  I will try this out if & when I get some time.

Effect 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

it feels strange 4 me too. 2 years for maybe fixing the mt issue?!?!  now with this new firmware the playere 1 stops suddently(and no, is not the cable-i'm not retarded). don't ask me to make my own post because i'm not intrested. you people don't provide solutions you provide guessings. i will try to solve it myself if i can. by the way 1 cdj cost e 1500 at  least and for that money in my opinind the player it has to have inside a little computer - look at that lcd wich i think that is the cheapest that you can find in china. you can delete my post like marian's, i don't give a motorcycle but one thing is sure,  i will never pay 1 euro 4 pioneer hardware- i've made 2 years savings 4 this players, i love them but i'm a little frustrated. and another thing, i have traktor & audio 10 - in my opinion sounds louder & better than a cdj.

 

oreste 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Your are not the only one who is angry about the behavior of pioneer!

I only can hope they recorgnize it and fix the issues at least, for all products!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

I dont use MT when mixing, but when new firmware came out I tried it a bit and to be honest it worked comparing with previous firmwares.

Now I promise I will leave MT on for the whole mixing set and I will come back with feedback.

 

@oreste, in few months time I suggest you also try the new Kontrol F1. I quess it will perfectly match with audio10 and Traktor!! I will try it ;) Take care

Dream Treez 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

@ dream treez if you're joking that's the life. if you talk serious i don't thinks so. 1.i think i will invest no more because i am doing it for me at home the reason is 70% of people living in my country listen to this crap http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdcaYTD4q9E and the genere embraced by me wich is tech house is considered shit. 2 the people says that traktor is going to a ableton way wich i don't like but that it must be seen (maybe this week).

a thing must be understood. the traktor is not perfect because in these days the companies-corporation don't delivers quality, delivers  quantity an that is verry sad.  we will never can compare the built quality of cdj 100 (who is a legendary pice of steel in my opinion) with a cdj 2000 wich is a shiny thing who shows you error 8302 in the middle of the gig. maybe the things are not like i said, but is my opinion. excuse my bad english

oreste 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

@oreste, actually I am half joking, half talking serious!

First its up to you to decide if you will continue with your gear or decide to try also different hardware. But, it makes me kind of sad to hear you say that you will stop investing to music because you are doing it for yourself. The way I see it, it should be the other way around. However its your opinion and I respect it. I will continue to invest to music because I really enjoy it myself first and then for others.

Anyways, concerning cdjs, I will agree that cdj100s is excelent built quality for the value of money cost back then, but now are really cheap if you want to buy them, even if you wanna buy them brand new. Cdj100s play only cds, has 3 effects with hold botton, MT, one pitch range of 10%, cue botton, auto cue botton and a "rubb" plater. A player like cdj100s would be perfect back at the end of the 90s but now its 13 years since then and things have changed. OK, cdj2000 has a few problems and it doesnt feel as solid as cdj1000 but in other hand comparing those two I prefer cdj2000 because it has better functionality which satisfies me.

Please tell me a product out in market that will give you lifetime waranty that will not get broken. Any time, any day, something might get happen. A few years ago, I bought a KP3. At first everything was fine. After a couple of months the pad wasnt working properly. I was pressing it at the right and and the led on the pad or the sound of it was like I was pressing it to the left. I got it back at the shop and they send it to the technicians. After a month it came back saying it was tested and it was ok. I plugged it but still same problem. I got really angry (I was younger back then!). Imediately I went back at the shop and plagged it in a cdj800 over there so that they see live what the problem is cause first time I only explain them by words. The owner of the shop agreed with me that my KP3 had a problem at the pad. Then I told him that this is crap. I also told that technicians kept my KP3 for a month with no results and that I want a new one. First he called the technicians to see what they did to it. The technicians said that there was a problem but they fixed it. Then he explained them, that the problem still exists and they said that either send it back to see it again or call the manager. We called the manager. After explaining to him the problem and that it just came fixed and still its not working, I said that the waranty is still on and that I want a new one. At first he said that he cant do that. Then I suggest to him either change it or else I would go by law to claim a new one and maybe some money for time of waiting. Suddenly he asked me to record a video showing it and if its faulty he will come back to me. After a day, he called the shop that he will send a new one and once I get it to send the broken one. Since then my new KP3 was fine.

All I am saying is that when you buy this kind of equipment, you should expect everything.  And if warranty is off, expect to pay it as well to fix it. That is a risk you take when you buy it.

 

Sorry for the long post but this is how I feel. Maybe for you cdj2000 is not good or reliable for the value of money. I respect that. In the other hand there are also cdj900, cdj850, cd450 to decide which one fits you most. There is also other brands to choose from expect pioneer. Its up to you..

 

Dimitris

Dream Treez 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

I Totals disagree!!!
I have private a set of one DJM 2000 and 2 CDJ 2000s and it costs about 6k! For that much money IT HAS TO WORK! Sometimes mistakes happens in product development, but you have to take it serious and fix it. The players are about 3 years or more on market and still don't work right. Same with the DJM 2000, they totaly broken it with the last firmware update! And a lot of us bought it in hope that there will be updates which brings more functionallity, f.e. to the touch display. These were dissapionted too! And this sucks a lot!

Back to topic:
I tested it this evening live and it was horrible. Started good but Fter 3/4 tracks all the issues described in the first post began at all 4 players! I stopped MT and went on normally, because it sounds that I loosed the ability to mix, espacially while mixing together!
And I also talked to some other guy's who uses the CDJ 2000s in different setups too. They have the same problems with the current update!

So please Pioneer, PLEASE FIX THE CDJ 2000 AND THE DJM 2000 AT LEAST and take care of your products and costumers, otherwise they'll go away! And please give also the DJM 2000 more possibilities! There is so much potential in this mixer!

Greetings

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Hey Puls/Gavin, what do you think about this? What should I do?

THX

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Sorry, tried to reply from my mobile last night but had troubles with login...

First and foremost, we need to establish that there is a problem -- I'm not discrediting you when you tell me that "it was horrible", we need to know WHAT was horrible!  Was it the sound?  The master tempo was wandering?

I also need more information about when it happens - you originally said after 2 hours, but it's unclear if this happens over time or started all-of-a-sudden.  I also need to know if you changed anything in that time - were you using CDs then switched to USB sources?  Were the tracks on USB from rekordbox?

Complaining about a problem is fine and dandy if you just want to complain, but if you'd like us to fix the problem, we need as much detail as you can provide!  Thanks! 

Pulse 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Hi,

ok, I'll do! But I'm a bit busy in moment. I will try to test it completely till the end of next week, sorry.
Yesterday in the evening I was at a friend of mine. He has also a pair of CDJ 2000s and he has the same problems. He showed the issues to me. I am pretty sure it is definitely not only a problem of my players.

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

I can certainly appreciate that you're busy and will need some time to get back with the answers, but I hope you understand that it is important for us to know the conditions under which you're experiencing these problems.  Just saying "It starts to sound like two donkeys making love to a submarine!" isn't entirely helpful.  If you know when it happens, we can try and replicate it and then find the problem and hopefully a solution!

Pulse 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Hi Puls, short info in between:

Maybe I'm more close to the issue, but only MAYBE! I played tonight a 3 hour set minimal and tech-minimal in MT mode and it worked perfectly. On big PA absolutly no probs or sound issues. In the end I become a bit more melodic, mory housy and trancy... Maybe I imagine it but I say the sound become a bit more "dirty". After me a Trance DJ started playing and he got real problems. Sound was a bit skipping and sounds "digital". He enabled MT. after his set I talked to him and a few other DJs and it figuerd out, that mostly the Trance DJ's and melodic house DJs has issues.

This would confirm my initial suspicion with issues at melodic stuff. I'm back Tuesday and I hope I can make a short set recording in the evening at home with trance and melodic stuff. If my suspicion is right, I will cut out a short time where you can here it and would send it to you, so you can hear it by yourself! I can't make it earlier. sorry. You'll hear from me!

Greetings!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

For me MT is ok. Usually I don't go more than 2% in pitch range and I have MT off. Yesterday I played tracks that I had to pitch 5% or 5.5% and mix with other tracks that were at 0% pitch range. I did mix tracks with both players having MT on or one player MT off and the other player MT on. Absolutely fine. My mixing set was 3hrs and a half. I have firmware v4.10. I play with USB stick in player 1 and link in player 2. All tracks exported via RB v1.5.2

Dream Treez 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

HI, I do have to concur with Xador in that whilst the MT is more reliable from a mixing point of view i too have observed a decline in audio quality when deployed. It seems to occur when you use the platter to fine tune tempo which I would think may simply be a limitation of the function as it is digitally reproducing the track when played faster / slower. Sadly for me I still think it is unworkable but I do appreciate we have progressed. 

Paulm72 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

i'm totally agree with paulm72. the problem apperar when using the jog to adjust.

oreste 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Hi @ all!

First @ all, it has nothing to do with the platter! It worked fine with minimal and platter adjusting!

I have recorded a short sample with some Trance, first with MT, then without:

http://soundcloud.com/dj-xador/cdj-2000-issue

You can CLEARLY hear the problems. I have nothing done, no loops were set, no cue pionts were called, no hot cues were called also, no platter adjustinge were made, absolutely nothing!

Just USB @ the same player, playlist, track was choosen and played. And by the way, it doesn't matter if it's played by USB or Recordbox!!! It happens the same. And as you here in the second part, the MP3 ist totaly fine, 320 kbit/s from beatport I guess, but it also doen't matter, it happens also with min. 40 ore more mp3s I have tested too. And it doen't matter, if the mp3s were loaded via iTunes, Beatport or were recorded from CD by myself. Pitch is about 3% or something, but it doesn't matter to, witch pitch is chosen.

I personally think, that is has something to do how "complex" the tracks are. As I wrote yesterday, with more "simple" music, mens less tracks in the track, it'll work perfect! Trance is much melodic and has alot of sounds in it, maybe the player cannot hadle this?!?

I'll keep on trying with other genres too and will also test diferent behaviors @ the player.

 

I hope you guys from Pioneer can give me a response and Pioneer is able to repair it.

THX, greetings!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Thought it were only mine that didn't behave since some ppl here said things were smooth and pretty fine with new firmware.

Xador, I don't need to wait 2 hours for those problems to appear here. My tunes are always house jackin/funky/disco/deep stuff. Never away from that.

I am really sad about my CDJs. I just can't look at them the same way I did when I bought... This is so frustrating! Sometimes I feel like i went way back in time and I just dont know how to mix anymore! It feels like a eternal fight with the plates and things won't go smooth...    :((((

I'm just sad mates... I want my CDJs to work so I can open the cases, do what I know best and trust on my gear! ... and more, to be proud of them again!

heeellpppp! 

Stroboscope 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Hi,

@ Stroboscope: As I said, I was wrong! There is no time, when it started! This little record I made was straight @ the beginning!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

It will not sound the same as the original if the pitch is adjusted, I cant see how it ever will?  I'm no expert on how MT works, but it must be changing the sample rate to be able to do what it does, so hence you notice it.  BTW I'm not jumping in to defend MT but pointing out that sqeezing or pulling the sample points apart is always going to be noticable is it not?

Effect 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

@ Pulse: What's up? First you want me to do this and give exactly feedback, then I do and the nothing happens?

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

@ anyone from Pioneer: Why there is no response? Is it the same like the DJM 2000 issues? Just not talking about? Well, thanks!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

Maybe I 'm using it wrong but - from what I've seen. It does not hold tempo for longer than maybe 15 seconds.

movingzachb 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

@Xador - in your Soundcloud sample, you said you were at 3% pitch, was that  -3%?

I've identified the track you're using, I'll buy it to test it myself.  The Jitter - yes folks, Jitter - that I can hear in your sample does sound like MT at work, but this is what I would expect to hear BEFORE firmware v4.10 was released.

I'm not sure if this is possible, but have you tried re-flashing your CDJs to 4.10 again?  Else it may be worth trying to get the Mods to supply a re-flashable version of the firmware just to rule that out?

Mark90 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

First, it doesn't depend which track you use. As I wrote earlier, it happens if you use melodic or tracks with "a lot stuff" in it, so mostly seen @ trance for example. When I'm playing Minimal it works most of the time fine, some loops are not exact or some sound "Jitter" as you wrote happening sometimes. I'll try to reflash, but as I wrote also earlier, I'm not the only one with this issue. I know a lot DJs with the same problem. And one more time, all with different tracks from different sources!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

And sorry, I forgot, it was -3%. But sound problems also happens when you use + pitch!

Xador 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink
0
Avatar

I know it doesn't matter what track is used, but if we're both using the same one it makes comparisons easier.

I play 90% melodic trance and so was feeling most of the MT pain until firmware v4.10 was released.

I'm not concerned with the other DJs, here I'm talking with you about your unit so let's focus on that.  I don't care about source either.  A lot of people here think it's a big issue but I think that's a misconception.  For the record, mine will be Beatport WAV over RekordBox Pro Link.

And again I ask, you mentioned your sample track was at 3% pitch.  Was that minus 3% (-3%)?

Mark90 0 voti
Azioni per commenti Permalink