CDJ 3000 jog wheel pitch bend issue

＠Peterlazarenko 

>I tested against 2000nxs2 and they were completely different to the 3000 in usb mode. 

How did you compare the CDJ-2000NXS2 and the CDJ-3000?

Is it possible to show me how to compare?

What I did was play 2 identical tracks on both decks both same bpm and have master tempo off and tension set to middle. Play both tracks together get them in sync with crossfader in middle, then on the cdj2000 pull platter round one complete turn on side to bend pitch. Mind not to touch the top or it will stop. Then copy what you just done on the cdj3000 one complete turn. You will find it’s not in sync and will need 2 full rotations to be back in sync. Check out my video.

Also just try little nudges on the side to pitch bend try gentle, then try a little harder and you will see the difference is massive.

https://youtu.be/ns0a_F2UUKE

I actually sent my 3000 back to the store a couple of weeks due to this issue.

However will look to re-purchase if it can be fixed.

Does anyone on here have any feedback that this has been officially acknowledged as an issue (or defect) by Pioneer?

Many thanks in advance

Please note - this is not a defect; it's how the software is interpreting the signal sent from the jog. We are aware of this and our engineers are investigating. Thank you for your patience.

Hi all,

Regarding pitch bend / HID jog response, the engineers have provided this information:

1. [Current specification]
In Vinyl Mode and Pause status, when the side of the jog wheel is turned to move the playback position, you need to turn it faster than a certain speed.  
[Current status]
This issue will be improved in a future firmware update. 
Currently, CDJ-3000 engineers are performing the final testing. 


2. [Current specification] 
The pitch bend sensibility is different when using a USB device and rekordbox performance mode (HID).
[Current status]
Exactly the same specification is used for both CDJ-3000 and CDJ-2000nxs2. However, we need to implement some kind of improvements. 
We are still discussing and considering the optimal improvement measures for as many customers as possible because many models will be affected by this change. 
The measures will be considered separately from the #1 issue. Thus, we are still discussing when or how we should improve this issue. 

Thanks for your patience while they work on these items.

How can the second item be a problem if the CDJ-3000 playing off a thumb drive or SD card (as opposed to Rekordbox HID mode) is in fact the exact same specification of jog bend used on the CDJ-2000NXS2?  I'm not talking about my own personal preferences, rather I just mean that people said Rekordbox was a lot less sensitive than the CDJ-3000's own internal mode jog bend.  If the CDJ-3000 is indeed supposed to be jog bending exactly the same as the CDJ-2000NXS2 when comparing internal playback modes, then it would seem like the problem they're having is either that Rekordbox HID is not sensitive enough with the CDJ-3000 since the CDJ-2000NXS2 is certainly not overly-sensitive when playing off a thumb drive or SD card, or instead that some of these users have defective CDJ-3000s not up to spec.

Because physically, the new jog wheel is different, therefore firmware needs configuring to align with the new jog wheel

I don't know, just passing along what they said in our internal conversations.

@Ben Walker Aren't the jogs the exact same size?  Have you ever looked at the service manuals for the CDJ line?  The specs are very specific and exacting in terms of rotations per minute translating to a certain amount of bend, etc.  If the jogs are the same size and the specification for performance on both are the same in internal mode, this sounds like either an HID Rekordbox issue or an issue with some outright defective CDJ-3000s.

@Pulse.  Ok.

All valid points and I would say the latter - hence why I unfortunately sent mine back

@Reticuli I'm starting to think along the same lines as you. Mine are almost unusable and unfortunately my online purchase has a strict 14 day return which I have now missed.

I'm seeing far too many online videos of people using them without the instant issues that I and others are experiencing.

More worrying though is the fact we have stated the issues and 5 weeks later we have no solution or guidance. There are many, many issues that I, and others, are suffering and I am frankly bemused by the silence.

£4.4K out of pocket is how I currently feel. 

You always have your manufacturer warranty and Rekordbox HID in the meantime.

@ I don't use HID and cannot see myself ever using it. There are far more problems than the pitch bend, which is also being seen by users in HID mode. HID mode is no quick fix to freezing decks and so on. Manufacturers warranty is great, but considering I sold my 2000NSX2's to purchase the 3000's I don't see why I should be sat here asking for answers regarding kit I cannot use. Manufacturers warranty.... send them back to us and we'll return when fixed.... I am still £4.4K out of pocket and with no kit to use.

@Grieg > I'll ask you to please file an inquiry ticket here and our support team will gather some additional information to assist you in resolving this issue.

@Pulse I have now entered a ticket. I didn't before as I have seen many report the same issues, so was hoping for a quick fix.

Sorry for moaning, but I'm gutted and missing my deck time.

No worries, I totally understand and we want to make sure that this is properly resolved for you regardless of the dealer's return policy. Our ticket team will assist you as soon as they can.

@Pulse, thank you, appreciated.

I just don’t understand if they are set up the same as the cdj 2000nxs2 why they are completely different in usb mode and feel terrible on the 3000, but work perfect and absolutely identical in hid mode on both the 2000 and 3000. ???

The only logical explanation is that the new and improved jogwheel on the cdj3000 is completely different in design and moves differently so should not be set the with same parameters as the 2000nxs2 and be set to compensate the difference in movement.

@Peterlazarenko I started to wonder if the drop in voltage on the USB from the 2000NSX2 to the 3000 was the issue, but then tried to quieten my mind 😬

I got my hands on three diferrent 3000, one in a Shop, compared to a 2000nxs2 next to him, and my two at home compared to my xdj xz, and all these units behave exactly the same when playing from usb. A half turn on any device gave me the exact same result.

As pulse sayed, in HID the sofware interprets the jog turn different and i find it a good idea to make the usb Mode more like HID, but for the moment i have no problem to play my sets with the 3000.

Did anyone whos complaining about the jog have actuely compared the 3000 against a different device like i did? (2000, 1000xdj, xz)

> Exactly the same specification is used for both CDJ-3000 and CDJ-2000nxs 2.
The above shows that there is no difference in operation between CDJ-3000 and CDJ-2000nxs 2.
In addition, there is no difference between the CDJ-2000nxs 2 and the CDJ-3000 in the comparison results of the operation when used standalone.
It works with the same movement (sensitivity)

However, it seems that they are considering implementing some improvement.

Just to add i have tested some of this and i concur with the Op there is a difference.

Looking forward to the new FW.

Hi Pulse

Is there any update on the pitch-bend sensitivity issue / improvement and whether this can be applied through firmware?

Do we also know if this is affecting all CDJ 3000 units?

I ask as I had to send mine back because of this. However will re-purchase if I have confidence this can be applied through firmware in the very near future,,,

Many thanks

'2. [Current specification] 
The pitch bend sensibility is different when using a USB device and rekordbox performance mode (HID).

[Current status]
Exactly the same specification is used for both CDJ-3000 and CDJ-2000nxs2. However, we need to implement some kind of improvements. 
We are still discussing and considering the optimal improvement measures for as many customers as possible because many models will be affected by this change. 
The measures will be considered separately from the #1 issue. Thus, we are still discussing when or how we should improve this issue. '

Ben,

As posted, it's not a flaw or mechanical defect - it was a choice made for the jog response parameters and they're investigating changing that for improved performance. That change will be possible via firmware update.

We don't yet have a timeline for the release but will update this topic when we have more details.

Thanks Pulse

Glad this is being addressed, as will ensure less disparity between the NXS2 and 3000 jogs, ensuring DJs can more seamlessly make the switch (which I understand is one of Pioneer DJ’s core principles for their club standard players).

However currently, the disparity between the jog on the NXS2 to that of the 3000 is too large a gap..

Still sounds like something doesn't comport between what the Pioneer DJ engineers back in Japan are saying and what the videos are showing.  From the videos posted, at least some CDJ-3000 jogs are functioning differently than the older CDJ jogs, and I don't just mean when paused, yet their engineers are talking like whatever firmware change they do is going to affect the entire CDJ line... as if people are complaining about all the CDJ jogs for the last decade on this forum thread, which they are not.

Agreed - nothing wrong with the jogs on the NXS line or the DDJ 1000 - all great jogs / best in class in my opinion - I would say the 3000 jog response / pitch-bend is sub-par to these units currently

Yeah not sure how changing the firmware on the 3000 to make it right is going to affect other units ??? Also surely the easiest option would be to put a user adjustable setting ? Or just make the same as nxs2

I think it's simply something lost in translation in what they're replying - what we're being told is that it will be fixed. Don't sweat the details. ;)